Techdemo vegetation

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Thrawn
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Techdemo vegetation

Post by Thrawn » 2006-02-25, 17:35

Hi all!

Over the last few days, I created vegetation for Ca3DE in general and of course - if you like it - for use in the techdemo. Textures have been created with a vegetation script in Blender, modelling has also been done in Blender.

Every bush has 4 lod versions (except the one without leaves, which just got 24 polys).
Polycounts:
1.: 216
2.: 108
3.: 60
4.: 19

This first collection I did uses all the time the same model structure, I'll try to add other bushes, which are less dense and are build in another way (and of course with other textures) later.

You can find pictures of all models (7 right now) here!
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Carsten
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Post by Carsten » 2006-02-27, 11:07

Wow, Thrawn, that's very impressive!!
:groupwave1:

I hope that we can integrate these brushes into the TD map very soon... :)
Best regards,
Carsten
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Post by Thrawn » 2006-02-27, 14:54

Just found 2 screenshots I would like to share with you.

This is definitely the best looking forest I've ever seen in a game. Screenshots are from a Half Life 2 mod.

Image

Image

If you look close at it, you'll notice that the trees are just filled at the top to create some sort of roof. Like this, the whole forest looks dense (although the polycount isn't high). I don't know if we can do this too with our upcoming speed-tree like system, but this is the way we have to create the forest in the techdemo.

To the bushes: I had a look at other techniques for bush creations as used in Half Life 2, but they just suck, looks ugly (at least those which are modelled).

I don't know if I am able to create other bush sets, but what I can do: Decals of bushes to cover walls and wall covering bush models. I'll start work on them now!
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Post by Kai » 2006-02-27, 16:36

Hi i'm currently a bit ill (leichte Mandelentzündung) and so im not feeling that well ;)

To be hones the bushes are a bit odd, the shape is okay but have you ever seen bushes that look like a bunch/pile of leafs ? XD

Leafs of bushes are much, much more smaller, you used leaf decals of ordinary trees. The only one i really like is the rotten one, this one is great !

Trees: I'm sure we can do a similiar approach which looks great too ;)
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Post by Thrawn » 2006-02-27, 16:43

Thx for the feedback, I'll try to create another collection with other leafs and bushes which are less dense. If there would be spring, I could collect many leafs but right now I'm a bit limited when it comes to leaves ;S

Und gute Besserung!
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Post by Carsten » 2006-02-28, 11:41

I too think that the leaves are really huge compared to the overall size of the bushes - almost as big as pieplant (Rhabarber) leaves. :)

Smaller leaves, less density, and maybe leaves like ferns (Farne, http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Farne) would improve the look a lot?? Just an idea...

About the trees:
The "Speedtree" system is programmable anyway. For example, if you make a tree of thousands of polygons like those at http://images.ca3de-community.de/main.p ... itemId=269 it is usually desired to vary their color in some fashion: Some random component to make some leaves greener or browner than others, and some component to make them darker towards to center of the tree.
The same approach can of course be used to make the bright at the top (where the sun shines on them), and make them progressively darker towards the bottom.
It would be a "fake", but I think that such trees would well be possible.

Kai, auch von mir gute Besserung!
With the TD developement, we're making real progress almost every day and every week now! (E.g. last week I made several important CaWE enhancements, Thrawn made very promising bush models and textures for trees, etc.)
Best regards,
Carsten
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Post by Thrawn » 2006-02-28, 14:34

Smaller leaves, less density, and maybe leaves like ferns (Farne, http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Farne) would improve the look a lot?? Just an idea...
Yes, I'll try to do that.

Good to hear that the speed-tree like system is that flexible. I found another screenshot showing clearly how to create a good looking forest just by putting some leaves/branches at top of a tree.

Again a Half Life 2 mod, have a close look at the way the trees are built:

Image
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Post by Thrawn » 2006-02-28, 15:34

OK, I tried to follow your constructive critics and it looks like you were totally right. I used small leaves and took care that they were from bushes and I also created a less dense texture and -> the result is just awesome!!!

Looks 10 times better than the old onces, I'm overwhelmed by it's beauty XD

Click me I'm a link

Other good news: I just discovered multiple tropical plants in our house :blink2:
Like this, I will be able to create some decent other plants for the techdemo. @Carsten: I also discovered "Farne" in our garden, but as it is winter time, the plant is not in the condition to serve as a photo model ;) (3-4 months to go until it's again in it's full beatuy)
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Post by Thrawn » 2006-03-06, 22:09

Another new one, this times a very small bush. It can be placed at some walls, corners etc just to "break" a monotone grass vegetation to create some kind of vegetation variety.

Polycount: 24 for the high detail version. It's about 20-30 cm high.

Click me
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Post by Thrawn » 2006-04-21, 14:29

Just spent my time on creating farn for the techdemo.

Here is a first development shot.

Click me!

Didn't create dlod yet, the model you see is supposed to be the ultra high poly model and has 256 polygons.

I still have to play around with the contrast and the color, it's a bit bright right now.. I also would like to create different sizes and variations...

Tell me what you think :)

(I took a photo of ReFlexs' site, I'm gonna ask him now if I get the permission to use it, but I'm sure he grants me using it.)
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Post by Thrawn » 2006-04-22, 12:39

OK, I updated the texture and I think the farn now looks much better, more natural. I increased the colour intensity and changed the contrast.

Here is the result

I am now going to tweak the model a bit and then I'll create low poly versions for the dlod file!
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Post by Carsten » 2006-04-22, 21:39

Hi Thrawn!
I like your farns a lot, but I have one general question / suggestion: Please don't rescale your screenshots!
I recently tried your bushes in the TechDemo, I noticed that the edges of the leaves looked somewhat different than in the screenshots you posted, as a consequence of the rescaling (making them smaller).

The problem with rescaling is that it usually "improves" the image overall quality, but makes it a lot harder to diagnose display problems (like jagged edges, something Kai mentioned recently in #ca3de). It would also be easier to make suggestions on how to improve the edges if you posted the images in original size.

Besides that: Great work!! :up:

Best wishes,
Carsten
Best regards,
Carsten
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Post by Thrawn » 2006-04-23, 01:15

Well ok, I totally understand you point :)

Here is the full sized image of the farn:

Click me!

Yeah I just also noticed that the end of the farn leaves look cut of, I'm going to have a look at that tomorrow ;)

**EDIT**

I fixed the sudden end of th farn leaves.

I also finished creating the lod versions.

Lod1 has 256 polygons,
Lod2 has 128 and
Lod3 has 32.
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Post by Kai » 2006-04-23, 14:54

I wonder about the pretty high polycount ?
256 tris is quite much for such a simple model.

I see 8 leafes elements.

256:8 is 32 , so you use 32 tris for a single leaf ??
I can't see any reason for what u need so many polys ?

Thinking of a plane, where 2 tris a one quad, you used 16 segments on one leaf, but i can't see where ??

I like the model but the polycount is far to much when looking at the image.
For example, my approach with 8 leafes would result in 3 or 4 quads per leaf > 8x4 =32 quads or 64 tris, which would look quite like your version. Even with a vertical split along the leaf, this only doubles the count.
Maybe you send me your model or show me a flat/gridview of that model. Im just wanna know ;)

Don't model the floral stuff like it is only one, like for example in a house or entrance.
This model is supposed to be use very often and combined with quite a lot of other plant models, so they intersects a lot, and its hard to see all the mesh detail.
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Post by Carsten » 2006-04-23, 15:12

I agree with Kai: I like the plant, but the polycount is pretty high.

My argument starts at the Lod3 plant (the one with the least detail): I think that it should have 16 tris (two per leaf) at most, maybe even only one triangle per leaf or fewer (if that is possible).

I have to admit though that I have no idea how you created the LoD levels: by hand?? automatic function in Blender??

Maybe it is even possible to combine several farn leaves into common (shared) triangles?

Oh, and please don't get me wrong: Your plant is great and it works! Few can claim such success! ;) I also realize how much work that is, and would not hesitate a second to include your plant with the TD - the points above are just observations to make the best even better! :D


Another idea / suggestion:
If the plant is (or you make it) sufficiently "flat", so that it is quasi always seen from top, and quasi never from the side (e.g. because it is only as high as the players knees or upper legs), then maybe we need no sorting for the individual leaves, and can turn on alpha-blend mode: in the cmat file, use

Code: Select all

blendFunc src_alpha one_minus_src_alpha
but not

Code: Select all

alphaTest
***EDIT***
On a second thought, I think the above won't work. This is because the individual leaves are overlapping each other... Maybe if you made a simpler version of the plant, with only three or four leaves, alpha-blending might work...
Best regards,
Carsten
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